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arnoudk
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THE "consensus"

Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:54 pm

There are cracks forming in the Hong Kong "consensus" - I write it in quotes because it really is not a consensus at all. It is at best a letter of intent between a very select group of people.

http://www.blockcy.com/shocking-allegat ... -consensus
Shocking Allegations Place in Doubt the Hong Kong “Consensus”
2 March 2016
Wang Chun, one of the founders of F2Pool, stated yesterday that Alex Petrov, Chief Information Officer at Bitfury, “had bought a long position just before the [Hong Kong] roundtable, if we did not agree, he would lose huge financially.” Wang Chun further states that Alex Petrov asked him “to “respect” his time by agree[ing to] the consensus asap”. In the absence of these two reasons Wang Chun “would probably have escaped away that night”. Alex Petrov has not yet responded to our requests for comments.

This shocking revelation of collusion and insider dealing is the latest in a series of debacles following the public announcement of “consensus” after an 18 hour long meeting between major miners and some Bitcoin Core developers.

...
The article is full of important info, such as the (almost?) willful exclusion of Classic developers. Inviting someone for a meeting in China, with just a fwe days notice, is a tactic to wilfully exclude someone while being able to say they were invited. Yes, they technically were. I could invite you to join me for dinner tonight. Now, you are invited. Does not mean you'll be able to make it to this country any time soon.
Little is known about what happened during one of the most important meetings in bitcoin’s history where approximately 90% of miners were in attendance with few willing to answer our questions. What is known is that the meeting was organized around late January, early February, allegedly in secret. It was brought to public attention on the 15th of February when Marshall Long, the Chief Technology Officer at Final Hash enquired in a public chat about the meeting, stating that no one on the Classic “team” had been aware that a meeting was to take place. He asked to attend, but was told by Kang Xie, one of the organizers of the meeting, that there was no space left.

On the same day, Marshall Long made a public announcement entitled “Core is Planning A Secret Meeting in Hong Kong!”, where he states: “Several miners were told the Classic team would be attending a meeting in Hong Kong ... To the best of my knowledge no classic team members were even told about this meeting. I especially was never told about this.”

On the same day at least two members of the Classic “team” were asked about the meeting. Jeff Garzik, a long standing contributor to bitcoin’s code, disputing that he received an invitation, stated that he was asked whether he was to attend the meeting, presumably by Samson Mow, on the 15th of February. He could not however attend because it coincided with his son’s birthday.

Gavin Andresen, Chief Scientist at the Bitcoin Foundation, in responding to a number of our questions stated that he was invited to attend by Samson Mow on the 15th of February, but could not attend as he was on vacation with his extended family and had been booked to attend the Financial Cryptography conference in Barbados. Jonathan Toomim, one of the developers of Bitcoin Classic has previously publicly stated that he was invited to attend two days before the meeting, therefore on or around the 18th of February, with the meeting held on the 20th of February. He stated that he could not attend as he could not find someone to look after his mining facility in such a short notice.

With, presumably, at least three spaces now available due to three individuals unable to attend, and with only one member of the Classic team able to make it, it is not confirmed whether Marshall Long tried again to gain access. However, sources familiar with the matter state that “they” simply did not want him to be present because they feared that an agreement would be impossible if members of the Classic team were present.
Underlines are mine. Note that this article is not very clear on all the sources and it may not all be true. But you'd have to question how much value this "consensus" has. In my view it is not worth the paper it is written on. Seriously.
Excited about the potential of Bitcoin Cash in the beautiful country of Belize.
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Re: THE "consensus"

Wed Mar 02, 2016 10:21 pm

There are cracks forming in the Hong Kong "consensus" - I write it in quotes because it really is not a consensus at all. It is at best a letter of intent between a very select group of people.

http://www.blockcy.com/shocking-allegat ... -consensus
Shocking Allegations Place in Doubt the Hong Kong “Consensus”
2 March 2016
Wang Chun, one of the founders of F2Pool, stated yesterday that Alex Petrov, Chief Information Officer at Bitfury, “had bought a long position just before the [Hong Kong] roundtable, if we did not agree, he would lose huge financially.” Wang Chun further states that Alex Petrov asked him “to “respect” his time by agree[ing to] the consensus asap”. In the absence of these two reasons Wang Chun “would probably have escaped away that night”. Alex Petrov has not yet responded to our requests for comments.

This shocking revelation of collusion and insider dealing is the latest in a series of debacles following the public announcement of “consensus” after an 18 hour long meeting between major miners and some Bitcoin Core developers.

...
The article is full of important info, such as the (almost?) willful exclusion of Classic developers. Inviting someone for a meeting in China, with just a fwe days notice, is a tactic to wilfully exclude someone while being able to say they were invited. Yes, they technically were. I could invite you to join me for dinner tonight. Now, you are invited. Does not mean you'll be able to make it to this country any time soon.
Little is known about what happened during one of the most important meetings in bitcoin’s history where approximately 90% of miners were in attendance with few willing to answer our questions. What is known is that the meeting was organized around late January, early February, allegedly in secret. It was brought to public attention on the 15th of February when Marshall Long, the Chief Technology Officer at Final Hash enquired in a public chat about the meeting, stating that no one on the Classic “team” had been aware that a meeting was to take place. He asked to attend, but was told by Kang Xie, one of the organizers of the meeting, that there was no space left.

On the same day, Marshall Long made a public announcement entitled “Core is Planning A Secret Meeting in Hong Kong!”, where he states: “Several miners were told the Classic team would be attending a meeting in Hong Kong ... To the best of my knowledge no classic team members were even told about this meeting. I especially was never told about this.”

On the same day at least two members of the Classic “team” were asked about the meeting. Jeff Garzik, a long standing contributor to bitcoin’s code, disputing that he received an invitation, stated that he was asked whether he was to attend the meeting, presumably by Samson Mow, on the 15th of February. He could not however attend because it coincided with his son’s birthday.

Gavin Andresen, Chief Scientist at the Bitcoin Foundation, in responding to a number of our questions stated that he was invited to attend by Samson Mow on the 15th of February, but could not attend as he was on vacation with his extended family and had been booked to attend the Financial Cryptography conference in Barbados. Jonathan Toomim, one of the developers of Bitcoin Classic has previously publicly stated that he was invited to attend two days before the meeting, therefore on or around the 18th of February, with the meeting held on the 20th of February. He stated that he could not attend as he could not find someone to look after his mining facility in such a short notice.

With, presumably, at least three spaces now available due to three individuals unable to attend, and with only one member of the Classic team able to make it, it is not confirmed whether Marshall Long tried again to gain access. However, sources familiar with the matter state that “they” simply did not want him to be present because they feared that an agreement would be impossible if members of the Classic team were present.
Underlines are mine. Note that this article is not very clear on all the sources and it may not all be true. But you'd have to question how much value this "consensus" has. In my view it is not worth the paper it is written on. Seriously.
What the Chinese must understand is that it is a give and take scenario.

The market is so large for Bitcoin that if everyone works together now, the benefits will continue for generations.

Instead of the banter, reach an understanding.

Together, you will make the change, so make it :)

As for last minute meetings in China, this is not required as you can facilitate a conference by video.
Image

If you are running a version of Bitcoin Core, stop using it. Upgrade to Bitcoin Unlimited or Classic immediately.

Fix Your Unconfirmed Transaction.

Vote for the future of our Bitcoin network!

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arnoudk
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Re: THE "consensus"

Thu Mar 03, 2016 3:34 am

As for last minute meetings in China, this is not required as you can facilitate a conference by video.
Exactly, we have a state of the art space-age financial network - and they are discussing how to run it by gathering in a cave around a campfire, drawing figures in the sand with a stick.
Excited about the potential of Bitcoin Cash in the beautiful country of Belize.
Developer of the RegisterDocuments.com Document Registration Service (using the Bitcoin Cash blockchain).

iFixBTCmemoryIssues
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Re: THE "consensus"

Thu Mar 03, 2016 9:00 pm

As for last minute meetings in China, this is not required as you can facilitate a conference by video.
Exactly, we have a state of the art space-age financial network - and they are discussing how to run it by gathering in a cave around a campfire, drawing figures in the sand with a stick.
For the next conference in China, I will pay for the video equipment rental and setup for the duration of the meeting. It can be live-streamed to the web for everyone to participate. Send me a PM prior.

Easy solutions for easy problems :)
Image

If you are running a version of Bitcoin Core, stop using it. Upgrade to Bitcoin Unlimited or Classic immediately.

Fix Your Unconfirmed Transaction.

Vote for the future of our Bitcoin network!

User avatar
arnoudk
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Posts: 631
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Location: Belize

Re: THE "consensus"

Thu Mar 03, 2016 9:06 pm

... gimme gimme gimme free monnneeeeeee now....
Bla bla bla. You should not be asking for free money, but for a job. And you should not be posting this completely and utterly unrelated message in a thread that has a different subject. Show some respect to the community, you fraud! ;)

@MODS - please delete this message and the one before it ;)
Excited about the potential of Bitcoin Cash in the beautiful country of Belize.
Developer of the RegisterDocuments.com Document Registration Service (using the Bitcoin Cash blockchain).

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Re: THE "consensus"

Fri Mar 04, 2016 7:11 am

'Consensus' is an overreach. There was a deal negotiated. The developers got a commitment from the miners not to run any software not written by them. The miners got no specific commitment, more like a vague promise to consider a hardfork in code this summer, which might include a block size increase of 2MB or more (unspecified). In my opinion, the miners did a terrible job negotiating, especially considering they had all the power.

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