I'm Charlie Shrem, Bitcoin Pioneer currently in Federal Prison. AMA!

[CharlieShrem]

Hi Charlie,

When you are released, will you be able to work for a bitcoin company (exchanges, wallets, etc), or start your own bitcoin company again? Or do you know if as part of your release, you will not be allowed to engage in "bitcoin activities?"

Best wishes,

David

and what kind of company would you start?

In the USA, we have layers of infrastructure around telecom, money movement, voting, internet, online speech. I'd like to start or join a company that's looking to do just that in places that need it the most.

[ibrightly]

What books have you read?
How are you spending your time?
Have you talked to fellow inmates about Bitcoin?
Were they curious?

Hey,

I've read over 70 books so far, I keep a list of course! It includes Crytponomicon, economic related books by Mises and Bastiat and spy thrillers as well. Nothing like a good novel! I just read a great history trilogy by Ken Follett called The Century Trilogy and a fantastic Russian classic called A Day In the Life of Ivan Denisovich

I keep myself very busy with a rigorous schedule. I'm a GED teacher, so I teach students to get their high school diploma. One of my students is 71 and he's doing very well! I take classes about life, lifestyle balance, rational thinking, living with others, Yoga, and others. I cook alot, workout every day, walk or run on the track and play sports. I read at least 200-300 pages a day of whatever book I'm reading. I sleep at midnight and wake up 5am every day so I push myself. Every day I do pull-ups, chin ups, dips, and pushups. I've lost over 20 pounds and in the best shape of my life.

All the inmates know about Bitcoin! I'm even teaching them about Sidechains, Ripple and others so they understand what the industry look like. Many people here even owned Bitcoin before they came in. We have alot of programmers here, finance guys, doctors, and economists. Just the other day, someone asked me to schedule an hour with him so he can pick my brain. Everyone is very respectful and clean. This is our home for now and we treat it that way.

Charlie

Amazing response - that really goes to show that you can thrive in just about any environment. I'm so glad to see you putting so much of yourself into learning and teaching. Looking forward to seeing you get back to normal space and contributing to the outside as much as you have on the inside!

[CharlieShrem]

Hi Charlie,

did you convince some prisoners to become bitcoiners too ?



ThX
-LCG-

Yes! They all love Bitcoin for different reasons. Of course we have skeptics, but as I educate they become less and less so. I got a few copies of Digital Gold mailed in, and even some of the staff here have read the book! Everyone has heard of Bitcoin, I just explain and teach it to them.

[CharlieShrem]

Hi Charlie!

It's really sad to see you in prison...
I hope that the thought that people still care about you on the outside keeps you going!

What I wanted to ask...
Do you think that fungibility issues are the origin of all the problems we see now with BTC regulation?
I did lose my trust in BTC because of this and wrote a reddit post about this issue a few months ago. i'll quote it below this message.

If you can't see where money comes from or money goes to, you can't be held accountable for what your customers are doing with the money. AML/KYC is still possible, but there isn't a "guilt by association". With BTC, you can get in troubles if you send coins to a guy who is using it on f.e. SR, or when you accept coins who were used in a crime.

Do you remember cornering Jeffrey Tucker and explaining him all about BTC? Well, this is basically the same thing I'm doing now with you. You NEED to know about what I'll post next:

I am not here to pump altcoins or anything like that, but I think you should know more about the ring signatures that are implemented in the cryptocurrency 'Monero' ('coin' in Esperanto). It provides passive mixing across the whole network, no centralization required. You can even mix offline without consent of the others in the network. You can't even know a certain UTXO is spent or not. There is plausible deniability about whether you've send the coins or not.
This currency also uses "stealth addresses" by default. You only need one address. Nobody can track the money they receive from you, so there is no need for "HD wallets" or something similar. Just plain and simple, one address.
Also, there is a "viewkey" that, when made public, could prove certain transactions or make your balance transparent. It has privacy by default and is optionally transparent. So it's possible to still prove you made a certain payment (think about arbitration/escrow services, charities, etc)
This cryptocurrency is completely fungible and can't be 'regulated' in the way that BTC is.

Monero was fairly launched in april 2014, had no premine and has an active community of people who are aware of the fungibility issues with BTC. It is completely new code, not a fork of bitcoin. The development is done completely by volunteers and are funded by community donations. I'll link some more information below and would really like to keep you in the loop if you want. I hope that you look into this and don't just dismiss it as being a scam. I was an ideologically driven bitcoiner in the past, now I've become an ideologically driven monerano ('member of the monero community in Esperanto'). Although I love the bitcoin community, I don't believe BTC will be the revolution we all hope for.
Tokens need to be fungible to be able to be used as money. Money needs to be neutral.

My reddit post about fungibility issues:

My thesis is that the transparent nature of the Bitcoin Blockchain leads us to the path of (nasty) government regulation.
This won't be some long theoretical opinion about technical Bitcoin flaws, I will provide you with some clear practical examples. People who love to have extensive government regulation, please move on and ignore this post.

What is exactly problematic about a transparent blockchain? Well, every UTXO has a history. This means mainly 2 things:
1) people who receive a transaction can see this history
2) miners who put transactions into blocks can see this history
Let me be clear. The issue we are talking about here isn't anonymity, it's fungibility.

You can try to hide your coins as much as you want, if you tried to mix your coins using a mixer, coinjoin or another type of "anonymity enhancing feature", we will at least be able to detect that you did. We maybe won't know who you are, but those coins can be flagged as "possible suspicious activity on the blockchain".

So what's the big deal about that? Well, this gives governments the possibility to regulate BTC transactions. Let me explain: Basically it comes down to these 2 possible scenario's: blacklisting and whitelisting

Government could on one hand through “whitelisting” obligate bitcoin users to identify themselves when they purchase bitcoins (this is already happening: KYC and AML) and ask them to whom they are transferring these bitcoins (Coinbase is already asking this for some transactions).
In the future this could lead to a situation in which only “identified” bitcoins would be spendable at regulated payment processors. Every business that accepts bitcoin in a certain jurisdiction would need to use a certified payment processors that only accepts "whitelisted" coins.
As a result, your anonymous bitcoins would only be spendable if you match them to your identity through a regulated authority (exchange, wallet service or directly through government). If you try to spend other coins, the payment processor could send them back you you (best case) or send them to a government wallet (worst case) and maybe you can claim the coins after you identify yourself (at least you have your coins back...)

A more aggressive approach is “blacklisting”. This is a system whereby the government makes it illegal to process certain blacklisted UTXO's.
Of course you would say that no miner would comply... But think about it. Would a large mining farm operator risk going to jail for "money laundering" or will he comply? After all, he has electricity bills to pay. The profit will be more important than the ideology.
This kind of regulation leads to a loss of fungibility. Bitcoin isn't fungible anymore if one bitcoin is accepted for payment or isn't mined anymore and another isn't.
If you are thinking that i'm exaggerating because there are a lot of jurisdictions and there will always be places where there will not be this strict regulation, you are right.
But it gets worse...

Not only governments but even companies will start to apply regulation by themselves as a form of self-censorship, because they fear government crackdown on their business:

We already saw the "whitelisting version" with the deposit of the Evolution coins to BTC-e. Those coins weren't allowed by an exchange that is pretty anonymous themselves! The reason is that they don't want the CIA and Europol on their doorstep, so they decided not to accepts possible money laundering activity.

And what about the blacklisting by the miners? I'm sure there will be ideologically motivated miners that will keep processing blacklisted UTXO's.
But there are far less pools than there are individual miners. The regulation will slowly affect this. I see a 5 stage system:

1) there will be some pools that voluntarily adopt the regulations, because they fear government crackdown (same situation as BTC-e with the Evolution coins)
2) some miners fear the government, so they ask their pool operators if they will comply with the regulations. If not, they move to a "regulated pool". It will slowly become a disadvantage for pool operators to not comply. If one uses mixed bitcoins, the transactions will start to suffer from delays because of less miners processing them.
3) the regulation will become more harsh. Building on a block that contains blacklisted transactions will become illegal. This will lead to more pools censoring themselves because they fear they will loose the block reward if they don't comply
4) the "illegal block depth" will become larger (f.e. not building on a chain which 3 blocks "deep" had a blacklisted transaction; more pools start to comply
5) almost everybody now complies and blacklisted UTXO's won't be spendable unless they pass through a regulation authority.

In essence this could lead to three kinds of bitcoins:
White bitcoins: bitcoins that satisfy the identification regulation.
Grey bitcoins: bitcoins that are not yet identified, but which are not actively anonymized. transactions are allowed, but not spending them at a certified payment processor.
Black bitcoins: bitcoins that are banned by miners. Processing them is illegal. Maybe even owning them...

The consequence?
Bitcoin will not be fungible anymore: you can’t just use a grey or black bitcoin to buy something from a webshop. If the government is able to discover that you possess black bitcoins or process blacklisted type transactions, you could even be seen as a someone committing a crime.

Eventually Bitcoin will become a fast payment system without counterparty risk but with full government control.
Is that what we really want?

And if you think these are all unlikely scenario's then well... we will talk again in 5 year's time.

Links about Monero (XMR):
The whitepaper describing the technology: https://cryptonote.org/whitepaper.pdf
Our bitcointalk thread (first post has a lot of info): https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=583449.0
our website: http://www.getmonero.org
if you want specific info, I suggest you just mail the development team: dev@getmonero.org

friendly greetings from Belgium,
take care!

dnaleor

Hey man,

Thanks! I'm going to try and answer your questions, and comment on your post to the best of my ability.

To your first question: Yes and this has always been the case. If you look back a few years, Jon Matonis wrote that if you don't have fungibility, Bitcoin will die.

Bitcoin is and must always be 'Digital Cash' in the sense that it stays as true to cash as possible. When I hand you a dollar bill, its private. I have no idea where that bill has been, and where its going to go next. Thats why cash is king. If Bitcoin wants to ultimately be a viable payment system and money, it needs to stay this way. If not, it will lose its integrity and will become another paypal and eventually die out. I cannot stress this enough.

This has nothing to do with governments, guilty by association, drugs or anything. This is something that is embedded in the bedrock of Bitcoin. If Satoshi wanted Bitcoin to be anonymous he would have not created a public ledger, nor would he publish all of its code and the BTC circulation schedule would not be public. The US dollar is anonymous in that sense, so is the Euro, a Paypal Dollar, ect. Bitcoin is private, in the truest sense of the word. Whitelisting, blacklisting are all bad ideas. Terrible ideas.

Now, what about the solutions to the blockchain size problem? Unfortunately I have no access to the internet thus I cant do the research to make an informed opinion. Ideally I'd like to read all the BIPS, the code itself and corresponding discussions. However I am in favor of a solution that gives the possibility for a blockchain size increase relative to the market that does not alter the integrity of Bitcoins core values.

Thank you

Charlie

[rogerver]

I'm sorry everyone, Charlie just emailed and said:

(Removed per Charlie's request.)

In short, he can't continue the AMA at the moment.

If you want to post a message for Charlie below, it will be forwarded to him, but I don't know if he will be able to reply.
It is really a shame what America has become.

To anyone working at the prison holding Charlie who is reading this, remember, locking people in jail for victimless crimes makes you the criminal.
"Just following orders" or "just doing your job" is not an excuse.

This is what you look like to the outside world:

[dnaleor]

Such a shame this AMA is shutting down

I hope you can take a look at that whitepaper, Charlie!

[grabberfish]

We have alot of programmers here, finance guys, doctors, and economists. Just the other day, someone asked me to schedule an hour with him so he can pick my brain. Everyone is very respectful and clean. This is our home for now and we treat it that way.

Incredible. It sounds like less like a prison and more like a professional conference. I though only people deemed dangerous to society were supposed to be incarcerated? It's almost as if someone is making a shit-load of money from locking docile people up in prison.

[rogerver]

It's almost as if someone is making a shit-load of money from locking docile people up in prison.

Can you guess when the war on drugs began?

[LiteCoinGuy]

Hi Charlie,

did you convince some prisoners to become bitcoiners too ?



ThX
-LCG-

Yes! They all love Bitcoin for different reasons. Of course we have skeptics, but as I educate they become less and less so. I got a few copies of Digital Gold mailed in, and even some of the staff here have read the book! Everyone has heard of Bitcoin, I just explain and teach it to them.

Thx. Digital Gold is indeed a great book.


edit:

fuck, hopefully you dont get in trouble for doing a harmless QA

@rogerver

seems to be a good business . reminds me of a movie from Michael Moore.

[BTCLuke]

I cant answer this one while Im in here.

Charlie

That tells me enough. Thanks!

It's clear you're getting stronger from this ordeal, as painful as it can be sometimes it's easy to see how it's good for you and will make you better at what you want to do when you get out.

[rogerver]

I'm sorry everyone, Charlie just emailed and said:

(Removed per Charlie's request)
Basically, he has to stop the AMA.

If you want to post a message for Charlie below, it will be forwarded to him, but I don't know if he will be able to reply.
It is really a shame what America has become.

To anyone working at the prison holding Charlie who is reading this, remember, locking people in jail for victimless crimes makes you the criminal.
"Just following orders" or "just doing your job" is not an excuse.

This is what you look like to the outside world:

[medicine]

The very term "victimless crime" seems to be a misnomer itself. The term implies a crime was committed, however I argue this generally is not the case. For instance, ingesting a substance that someone somewhere has listed as a substance that people should not be ingesting. This is not a "victimless crime," it's no crime at all. It's nothing more than an act that that individual has done based on their own decision making power.

I suggest a new term be coined for acts such as these. Maybe "minding my own damn business?"
Peace

[MagmaHindenburg]

I'm looking forward to more AMAs in this fourm!

[rogerver]

I'm looking forward to more AMAs in this fourm!

I have a feeling that some really good ones are coming soon.

[bitkilo]

It's unfortunate that Charlie had to stop his AMA but it was a great one to start out on, who would have thought that was even possible for even the short time it lasted.

Are there any suggestions as to who we should try get on next for AMA?
My choice would be Ross Ulbrict, maybe Roger could let us know if that would even be possible, after seeing Charlie take part in the last one I guess anything is possible. Its worth a try.
Roger it's time for you to work your magic.
Bring on Ross!

[rogerver]

Are there any suggestions as to who we should try get on next for AMA?
My choice would be Ross Ulbrict,

Hopefully we will get to do an AMA with Ross as a free man in the near future.
All the corruption by "law enforcement" should make it clear that the whole system can't be trusted.
It's time for the world to explore other, decentralized options.

[bitcoin.rat]

Hi Roger - missed the Charlie AMA ( a Rat's life is sometimes chaotic !) please pass on my regards to Charlie and I think learning Spanish would be an excellent move ( can see big bitcoin growth in Latin America in the coming 18 months )

[blockchain2020]

Hey Charlie

Sorry to have Missed the AMA. But.....

We've just started organising a conference in the heart of London's banking and finance district to coincide with the block halving in July 2016. We'd love to fly you over if you're out by then. If not, we're hoping to do a live broadcast of Mad Bitcoins during the day and it would be great if we can get that tied-in to a live AMA with you on that show during the Bitcoin halving.

This is a Bitcoin community project :

http://blockchain2020.com/block-420000/blockchain-2016/

[rogerver]

Hey Charlie

Sorry to have Missed the AMA. But.....

We've just started organising a conference in the heart of London's banking and finance district to coincide with the block halving in July 2016. We'd love to fly you over if you're out by then. If not, we're hoping to do a live broadcast of Mad Bitcoins during the day and it would be great if we can get that tied-in to a live AMA with you on that show during the Bitcoin halving.

This is a Bitcoin community project :

http://blockchain2020.com/block-420000/blockchain-2016/

I passed it along. Hopefully he will be able to answer.

[CharlieShrem]

Hey Charlie

Sorry to have Missed the AMA. But.....

We've just started organising a conference in the heart of London's banking and finance district to coincide with the block halving in July 2016. We'd love to fly you over if you're out by then. If not, we're hoping to do a live broadcast of Mad Bitcoins during the day and it would be great if we can get that tied-in to a live AMA with you on that show during the Bitcoin halving.

This is a Bitcoin community project :

http://blockchain2020.com/block-420000/blockchain-2016/

I'd love to discuss the possability, what month will it be taking place ?

Charlie

Please remember, I can't see the content of web links.

[blockchain2020]

Hey Charlie

Sorry to have Missed the AMA. But.....

We've just started organising a conference in the heart of London's banking and finance district to coincide with the block halving in July 2016. We'd love to fly you over if you're out by then. If not, we're hoping to do a live broadcast of Mad Bitcoins during the day and it would be great if we can get that tied-in to a live AMA with you on that show during the Bitcoin halving.

This is a Bitcoin community project :

http://blockchain2020.com/block-420000/blockchain-2016/

I'd love to discuss the possability, what month will it be taking place ?

Charlie

Please remember, I can't see the content of web links.

That's great!

We have reserved a great venue that can hold 500 people and we have a little flexibility on the dates. Currently, the block halving is due on July 26, so we have reserved July 25 and July 26, 2016. That may not go to plan in terms of coordinating the day with the block halving, but we shouldn't be too far away in terms of timing.

Event date & time: Tuesday, 26 July 2016 from 08:30 to 18:00 (GMT)
Location: 155 Bishopsgate, City of London, London

If there are any restrictions on your ability to travel, we'll arrange to beam you in or arrange for some written Q&A.

Well, let's hope everyone will be able to see you in person, in London!

(Thanks Roger for enabling the communication).

[Denker]

Hope you're doing fine Charlie. No easy time you have to go through right now.
I wish you all the best and hope to see you back in Bitcoinland when you cleared that hurdle.

best regards

[The_Void]

Can I draw something for you, Charlie? Im drawing and I feel maybe one of my pics could add some colours to your prison life.

[CharlieShrem]

I'd love to discuss the possability, what month will it be taking place ?

Charlie

Please remember, I can't see the content of web links.

That's great!

We have reserved a great venue that can hold 500 people and we have a little flexibility on the dates. Currently, the block halving is due on July 26, so we have reserved July 25 and July 26, 2016. That may not go to plan in terms of coordinating the day with the block halving, but we shouldn't be too far away in terms of timing.

Event date & time: Tuesday, 26 July 2016 from 08:30 to 18:00 (GMT)
Location: 155 Bishopsgate, City of London, London

If there are any restrictions on your ability to travel, we'll arrange to beam you in or arrange for some written Q&A.

Well, let's hope everyone will be able to see you in person, in London!

(Thanks Roger for enabling the communication).

Fantastic, lets talk when I get out!

Charlie

[JetSetTech]

Good Evening Charlie,
Growing up in community like ours all I can think of is how I'm going to make my next billion and make an impact upon the world.
Most people can not under stand me I have an iq of 160 have considered an extraordinary genius.
My field of expertise is technology to create-inspire-innovate.I have the ability to function perfectly on only three hours of sleep the rest of the time my mind is racing
I have developed what appear to be a photographic memory when I was 16 years old.doctors have to be eidetic memory which is truly uncommon.
The time has come for me to use these God given gifts
I am my own boss and can't imagine working for anyone else
It took me only a week to read up on on this Bitcoin
And understand this is the first decentralized digital currency even more specialized technology being utilized

I apologize for the chatter I am a little drunk

I hope you see this and answer back partner

Happy Holidays

[JetSetTech]

every second of every minute of every hour of every week of everyday checking Bitcoin wisdom


Life is all about evolution.
What looks like a mistake to others
has been a milestone in my life.
Even if people have betrayed me,
even if my heart was broken,
even if people misunderstood or judged me,
I have learn from these incidents.
We are human and we make mistakes,
but learning from them is what makes the
difference.

Let Me Know How I Can Help ???

[JetSetTech]

It's 12 am I remain awake while the rest of the world sleeps

Do understand coding for Bitcoin core
I currently know Python and Java
which do you recommend

[JetSetTech]

What ever happens to EVR?

[CharlieShrem]

Hope you're doing fine Charlie. No easy time you have to go through right now.
I wish you all the best and hope to see you back in Bitcoinland when you cleared that hurdle.

best regards

Thank you!

[CharlieShrem]

Can I draw something for you, Charlie? Im drawing and I feel maybe one of my pics could add some colours to your prison life.

Please! The address to mail it is on my website http://www.charlieshrem.com! I will hang it up in my locker! I love Bitcoin related drawings! I need to Bitcoin-it-up