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Coinbase transaction numbers

Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:10 am

Pardon me, I'm new to this forum.

I just started using (trying) Blockchair's block explorer in an attempt to start tracking my bitcoin purchases.

All my Bitcoin purchases were conducted via Coinbase's exchange.

Due to the fact that I'm still awaiting delivery of the last piece of hardware needed to setup my Cold Card wallet, all of my bitcoin is still sitting in Coinbase's "wallet".

As stated above, I'm trying to "track" the chronology of my purchases within the blockchain with special focus given to determining whether, or not, I can identify the "pedigree" of my bitcoin (e.g., did they originate in China?).

I "contacted" Coinbase's support team but was only redirected to that platform's transaction HISTORY with respect to my purchases (and associated transaction reference #s).

Am I missing something here? Even though I have not spent any of the coin I've purchased via Coinbase (and, thereby created a UTXO "paper trail"), shouldn't my purchases have generated multiple entries in the blockchain which, in turn, should have associated transaction numbers which I can use on Blockchair's block explorer platform/software to "research" the "pedigree" of my coin?

Can someone give me some advice?

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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:00 am

I'm not sure but I don't think you can track the history of your bitcoins beyond the transactions you yourself made.
If you don't mind me asking, why does it matter where your Bitcoin originated from? Since it is not a non-fungible cryptocurrency, every bitcoin is technically the same.
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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:15 pm

It's all about "institutional investors" and the (positive) impact they will/may have on the future price of bitcoin.

Recently, Kevin O'Leary (of TV's "Shark Tank" fame) - aka "Mr. Wonderful" - has stated that he has changed his mind regarding bitcoin (e.g., he used to think bitcoin was not worth his investment-firm portfolio's consideration, but, now that US regulators don't seem to have a big "problem" with bitcoin, he's willing to invest his, and his client's money into an asset (class) that is returning 200% on avg over the past 10 years; he's actually allocating 3% of his investment portfolio to bitcoin.) For more on bitcoin regulation(s), you might want to check into NYC's "bit licenses".

With that said, he appears to now being throwing "s**t" into the game by suggesting that "responsible" (US) institutional investors (i.e.,"greenies" who have a problem with - inter alia - the energy consumption/pollution associated with bitcoin mining) should/will avoid buying bitcoin which cannot prove its" environmental-friendly" provenance. In the past few days, he's participated in a few interviews which seem to suggest that his "concerns" are starting to be shared by some major (US) institutional investors... "They" don't want to buy bitcoin mined in China. This does not appear to be a joke!

Personally, I think this is a ploy on his part intended to convince potential investor to only buy bitcoin that he, and his ilk, offer as "clean coin" (i.e., their coins are not "blood-diamond" like).

Think about that and the implications thereof...

So, that's why I'm interested in determining/assessing the "provenance" of my own coins.

What say you?

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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Tue Apr 13, 2021 11:59 pm

Pardon me, I'm new to this forum.

I just started using (trying) Blockchair's block explorer in an attempt to start tracking my bitcoin purchases.

All my Bitcoin purchases were conducted via Coinbase's exchange.

Due to the fact that I'm still awaiting delivery of the last piece of hardware needed to setup my Cold Card wallet, all of my bitcoin is still sitting in Coinbase's "wallet".

As stated above, I'm trying to "track" the chronology of my purchases within the blockchain with special focus given to determining whether, or not, I can identify the "pedigree" of my bitcoin (e.g., did they originate in China?).

I "contacted" Coinbase's support team but was only redirected to that platform's transaction HISTORY with respect to my purchases (and associated transaction reference #s).

Am I missing something here? Even though I have not spent any of the coin I've purchased via Coinbase (and, thereby created a UTXO "paper trail"), shouldn't my purchases have generated multiple entries in the blockchain which, in turn, should have associated transaction numbers which I can use on Blockchair's block explorer platform/software to "research" the "pedigree" of my coin?

Can someone give me some advice?
hey dc007, when you purchase bitcoin from Coinbase there isn't an on-chain transaction. Your account at Coinbase is not a wallet, it's just a custodial account and your account balance is fetched from their database.

There wont be an on-chain transaction until you send a bitcoin transaction from your Coinbase account. At that time, and thereafter, you can look up the address you sent to on a block explorer (e.g., Blockchair) and see where the bitcoins came from.
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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Wed Apr 14, 2021 5:39 am

Hey nandibear,

I hear what you're saying and can agree to a point. My issue (still) is that, regardless of whether or not my purchased coin is in a "wallet" or in a Coinbase-controlled custodial account, the coin's genesis was that of a payment (at some point in the past) to a miner for work done (i.e., mathematical problem solved, block verified, you get paid).

Am I mistaken in my belief that the new bitcoin "paid" to the above-referenced miner was, in fact, the equivalent of a single Unspent Transaction Output (UTXO) which, over time, has been "broken down"/divided (i.e., as the miner participated in transactions involving said "original" bitcoin, associated "inputs" were generated as were associated "unspent transaction outputs" (UTXOs)) - all of which activity was subsequently appended to the blockchain itself (after all, the "blockchain" is literally a ledger consisting of a record of all bitcoin-related transactions). With that said, to me, logic dictates that the bitcoin I have purchased on the Coinbase exchange is merely a aggregate of UTXOs - economic activity which, according to the "rules" of blockchain technology, has been memorialized and appended to the blockchain at some earlier date (i.e., recorded in THE LEDGER and assigned a transaction ID) and is thereby "traceable" - regardless of whether, or not, the coin (i.e., UTXOs) "reside" in a custodial account or in an actual "wallet".

I agree with you that, once I conduct an actual "transaction" with another entity (via Coinbase's exchange), a transaction ID will be generated which, in turn, can be "traced" via the Blockchair block explorer, etc. Are you opining that, once said transaction occurs, I will be able to trace my coin's "lineage" back to its inception? That is what I am anticipating (with fingers crossed).

You may wonder why this is so important to me? Please review the response I submitted to the person who posted the first response to my initial request for advice on this topic. As strange as it may seem, there appears to be growing concern over each coin's "provenance' (i.e., did the coin's miner use energy-producing methods which were potentially harmful to the Earth's climate?). The answer to this question may prove to have a direct impact on the value of a bitcoin! Check out Kevin O'Leary's (of TVs "Shark Tank" fame) recent antics. He, and his associates (institutional investors), are comparing bitcoin mined in China to "blood diamonds". He "likes", and is actively "investing" in, bitcoin/bitcoin technology. He just "wants to ensure that his coins have the right provenance". Time will tell what, if any, effect on the price of bitcoin this type of ideology may have.

I am not making any type of political statement here. I'm just want to be as up-to-date as I can on "everything bitcoin".

What say you? Your advice is highly appreciated.

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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Sat Apr 17, 2021 8:39 am

Hey nandibear,

...

I agree with you that, once I conduct an actual "transaction" with another entity (via Coinbase's exchange), a transaction ID will be generated which, in turn, can be "traced" via the Blockchair block explorer, etc. Are you opining that, once said transaction occurs, I will be able to trace my coin's "lineage" back to its inception? That is what I am anticipating (with fingers crossed).

...

What say you? Your advice is highly appreciated.
Once you send a transaction out of your Coinbase account you can use a block explorer to view the address you sent to view the transaction received and the inputs & outputs of that transaction. You can then move backwards and view inputs and outputs of transactions at the address or addresses which sent to the address which sent to your address and so and so on moving further and further back. Most likely there wont be a single inception point. Your bitcoins likely originated from different blocks mined and by different miners.

Bitcoin is much like cash paper money fiat. If a wallet receives, for example, the following transactions: 1 BTC, 5 BTC and 3 BTC. Those are all much like paper money in that you cannot rip them into little pieces when you want to spend them. When you send (from a bitcoin wallet) a transaction in the amount of, for example, 0.0035 BTC you have to send an entire input which an address in your wallet has received and still has (or more than one input if needed to cover the amount your are sending). In the example above you have three (3) inputs in your wallet (could be at the same address or different addresses in your wallet): 1 BTC, 5 BTC and 3 BTC.

If you send (from the example above) 0.0035 BTC your wallet would send the 1 BTC (or, depending on what software you're using you could manually use any one of the 3 inputs as long as it covers the amount of 0.0035 BTC). The address you send that to receives the 0.0035 BTC and then the "change" (as it's called (or the difference in other words)), minus whatever fee you give the miners (depending on what software you're using you can decide the fee amount, if not your wallet software will make the decision for you based on the size of the transaction in bytes), is sent back to your wallet (and usually not to the same address you sent the transaction from).

Or, for example, if you want to send 1.1 BTC you would send the 1 BTC and the 3 BTC (so, two inputs). The address you are sending to would receive the 1.1 BTC and then the "change" (and minus the miner fee) would be sent back to an address in your wallet.

The bitcoin you bought from Coinbase may have come from anywhere, who knows, with some of it being traced back to blocks mined several years and some it from bitcoin blocks mined just a week ago and so on, and on, and on, and on and on. Who knows. Coinbase is an exchange so they're buying and then selling.
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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Sat Apr 17, 2021 1:16 pm

nandibear,

Thks. I found the first paragraph of your response to be most pertinent/helpful to my ongoing "search" (i.e., "Your bitcoins likely originated from different blacks mined and by different miners"). That is exactly the info I'm trying to identify.

I agree that, when/if I decide to relax my HODL-like hold on a tiny fraction of my bitcoin and initiate a transaction out of my Coinbase account (i.e., as of this writing, I would do this solely for the purpose of conducting investigative research), a transaction hash/ID will be generated and I will then be able to use a block explorer to view the associated input/output data of said transaction

However, I must offer some push back with regard to your hypothesis that "most likely there wont be a single inception point". If that were true, the notion of an immutable blockchain, and all of its promise, would be rendered non-existent. (Full disclosure: at some later date, I fully expect to be able to identity the "progeny of Satoshi's genesis block").

Since my last post, I have been in constant contact with Coinbase's Tech Support and have refused to settle for their disingenuous attempts to assuage my curiosity by repeatedly redirecting me to a page on their website which provides the DEFINITION of a transaction hash/ID as opposed to said Tech Support team members providing me with the actual transaction hashes/IDs associated with my bitcoin purchases. As I pointed out to their team members, my bitcoin didn't come from nowhere! I didn't mine it myself! Accordingly, per the "rules" of blockchain technology, all of the bitcoin in my account (i.e., bitcoin acquired via "purchases"/"transactions" on the Coinbase exchange) MUST HAVE ASSOCIATED transaction hashes/IDs.

Or...

Is someone suggesting that the Coinbase exchange is just "sitting" on a bunch of bitcoin and when a customer purchases bitcoin on the Coinbase exchange, without recording said movement/transaction on the blockchain (or any other place that is "auditable"), Coinbase staff/algorithm simply "moves" said bitcoin from Coinbase's communal/custodial "wallet" to the customer's account/portfolio? Wouldn't such a scenario require the customer to simply "trust" Coinbase staff to "do the right thing"? Wouldn't such a scenario (i.e., "trust" instead of "trust less") constitute an anathema to the underpinning ideology of the blockchain itself (i.e., Satoshi's blockchain design/coding made it impossible to "cheat" - thereby eliminating the need to "trust" a transaction's counter party)?

Anyway, yesterday, once again, with respect to this question ('"where's the transaction hashes/ID's?"), Coinbase Tech Support promised they would get back to me ASAP.

Pls note that, in equal parts, the prime motivation for this HODLer's (my) need to be able to examine every detail of every coin now residing in my Coinbase portfolio was (a) Kevin O'Leary's (Shark Tank's "Mr. Wonderful") recent suggestion that, depending upon their origin, much in the same way "blood diamonds" of Africa are, individual satoshis/bitcoin(s) may also be tainted (i.e., a suggestion that, depending upon where they were mined, individual sats/bitcoin should be "valued differently"), and, (b) a particular episode of the Whatbitcoindid(.com) podcast, in which the show's guest ("Shinobi") gave a detailed explanation as to what an "unspent transaction output" (UTXO) is and its importance to blockchain technology.

As I write this, I'm just finishing the set up of my newly-acquired Cold Card wallet. More fun!

What say you?

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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Sat Apr 17, 2021 8:49 pm

nandibear,

Additionally, and perhaps, most importantly, I assert that, if the Coinbase exchange does not maintain an "auditable" paper trail of my purchases of bitcoin and said bitcoin's "genealogy" (i.e., blockchain entries), such a lax system of "accounting" would render the blockchain's "double-spending solution" meaningless.

Again, Coinbase has "got some 'splaining to do"...

What say you?

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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Sat Apr 17, 2021 11:27 pm


...

Or...

Is someone suggesting that the Coinbase exchange is just "sitting" on a bunch of bitcoin and when a customer purchases bitcoin on the Coinbase exchange, without recording said movement/transaction on the blockchain (or any other place that is "auditable"), Coinbase staff/algorithm simply "moves" said bitcoin from Coinbase's communal/custodial "wallet" to the customer's account/portfolio? Wouldn't such a scenario require the customer to simply "trust" Coinbase staff to "do the right thing"? Wouldn't such a scenario (i.e., "trust" instead of "trust less") constitute an anathema to the underpinning ideology of the blockchain itself (i.e., Satoshi's blockchain design/coding made it impossible to "cheat" - thereby eliminating the need to "trust" a transaction's counter party)?

..

What say you?
nandibear,

Additionally, and perhaps, most importantly, I assert that, if the Coinbase exchange does not maintain an "auditable" paper trail of my purchases of bitcoin and said bitcoin's "genealogy" (i.e., blockchain entries), such a lax system of "accounting" would render the blockchain's "double-spending solution" meaningless.

Again, Coinbase has "got some 'splaining to do"...

What say you?

hey dc007,

I'm not 100% certain in regard to which Coinbase transactions are off-chain and which are on-chain.

I believe that Coinbase is a very reputable exchange, one of the best (if not the very best) fiat-to-crypto & crypto-to-fiat exchanges.

I did a quick search in regard to off-chain transactions at Coinbase. Some of what I found includes:

Why can't I see my transaction on the blockchain? - https://help.coinbase.com/en/coinbase/trading-and-funding/buying-selling-or-converting-crypto/why-cant-i-see-my-transaction-on-the-blockchain

What is off-chain sending and receiving? - https://help.coinbase.com/en/coinbase/trading-and-funding/sending-or-receiving-cryptocurrency/instant-sends

Neither of those articles mentions buying bitcoin but they do make it clear that bitcoins can be traded off-chain from one user's Coinbase account to another user's Coinbase account. It's just numbers in Coinbase's database(s).

There is another method of off-chain trading where private keys (for bitcoin addresses) are swapped from one user to another. I don't think this happens at Coinbase though when users buy bitcoin (maybe in other scenarios though, Coinbase does offer cold storage). For one, it's not secure to play around with private keys online and especially in regard to user accounts in a database which might get attacked by an intruder. Moreover, by swapping private keys you wouldn't be able to change the amount of bitcoins at a private key so unless you just happened to buy that exact amount which was available at a private key (or more than one private key, a combination of different amounts of bitcoin to match the exact amout you are buying) which Coinbase owns/controls it doesn't seem very practical at all (or who knows, I guess it's possible with a huge exchange such as Coinbase).

On-chain transactions can be expensive too (especially bitcoin (BTC) at the moment). If buys at Coinbase are on-chain then miner fees for all those transactions are passed on (in some form or another) to users. Maybe if the buy transactions are not put through immediately Coinbase could wait until they have, for example, a few thousand transaction to send (on-chain) to buyers they could send bitcoins to thousands of different addresses in just one single transaction (you can do that, send to multiple address in a single transaction, depending on which software you're using) which I think (?) would reduce the miner fee somewhat (would still be expensive though).

In any event I think buys at Coinbase are off-chain. Off-chain trading at most exchanges is a standard.

Worth noting also that Coinbase says 98% of customer funds are stored offline. See: https://www.coinbase.com/security

I recommend, and always have, not storing bitcoin on exchanges. Trade and then move your bitcoins to an address(es) that you yourself own (you own or control the private key(s)).

You could also look into decentralized exchanges as well as non-custodial blind escrow trading.
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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Mon Apr 19, 2021 2:02 am

Hey nandibear,

For the past day-and-a half, I have been engaged in the process of compiling an (useful/informative) update to this thread.

However, because of the amount of research involved, I will not post it for apprx 48 hrs.

Stumbled across a primer on how to setup my electrum (hot) wallet in "testnet mode", and how to use an associated "Bitcoin testnet3 faucet" to obtain "pseudo bitcoin" to be used during the "testnet mode" implementation of my electrum wallet (i.e., this setup facilitates "dummy-proof" practice executing bitcoin transactions while using "worthless" bitcoin (e.g., the "paper trading" of bitcoin)). The setup works like a charm! It provides a lot of the underlying transaction info I've mentioned in my earlier posts. It's very similar to using TD Ameritrade's Think or Swim platform (TOS) to conduct "paper trades" before engaging in trades using your "real money". However, this "(testnet mode") setup doesn't allow for the gathering/assessment of transaction hashes/IDs generated during ("real") transfers of bitcoin into hot (and cold) wallets both from, and to, the Coinbase exchange.

Just finished setting up a Cold Card wallet (a rather interesting experience in itself) and am now engaged in examining/analyzing the best-practice methodology (and associated transaction data created) of bitcoin transfer(s) from a hot wallet (electrum) to a cold wallet (Cold Card).

Next up is the capture, then analysis, of transactional data generated during the movement of bitcoin from the Coinbase exchange into my electrum wallet and onto my Cold Card wallet. From there I'll see if I can "back trace" the associated bitcoin to its point of origin (and identify the coin/satoshi's "provenance").

In order to facilitate a better understanding as to what exactly is "going on under the hood of the Coinbase exchange", I've found it necessary (and wise) to step back in time and research Coinbase's predecessor (the Mt. Gox exchange). That "step" necessitated the analysis of Mt. Gox's source code (what's "under its hood"?). After all, given that the Mt. Gox exchange (primarily "open source"-based) was founded in 2010, and, until its 2013 hack-related "insolvency", was the planet's preeminent bitcoin exchange, coupled with the fact that the (server/software-based) Coinbase exchange was "founded" in 2012, it stands to reason that any "resourceful" programmer (e.g., a Coinbase staffer/coder perhaps?) would simply "repurpose" (open source) code that was already written.

So far, my research has been instructive (at least, to me) and is providing valuable insight as to "the missing transaction hashes/IDs" of my Coinbase bitcoin purchases.

To be updated shortly...

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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Wed Apr 21, 2021 2:29 am

Still working on "problem" resolution... Making "good" progress...

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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Thu Apr 22, 2021 11:26 pm


...

Just finished setting up a Cold Card wallet (a rather interesting experience in itself) and am now engaged in examining/analyzing the best-practice methodology (and associated transaction data created) of bitcoin transfer(s) from a hot wallet (electrum) to a cold wallet (Cold Card).

...
I use the Electrum wallet for BTC. Great wallet in my opinion. I also use a fork of Electrum called Electron Cash (for Bitcoin Cash (BCH)). I use it every single day, one of the best BCH wallets ever! Their website is https://electroncash.org

...

In order to facilitate a better understanding as to what exactly is "going on under the hood of the Coinbase exchange", .....
I believe that Coinbase is a very reputable exchange, one of the best (if not the very best) fiat-to-crypto & crypto-to-fiat exchanges. That being said, there are some other large and very reputable fiat-to-crypto & crypto-to-fiat exchange. For example, Kraken.com and Gemini.com
Still working on "problem" resolution... Making "good" progress...
Please let me (or any reading this thread) know if you need any help or have questions.

BEWARE of anyone who might contact you in direct message and please NEVER share your private key(s) or seed mnemonic (recovery / backup phrase) with anyone (including support teams).

Before I forget also wanted to mention I used to use a pretty cool 3D and virtual reality blockchain explorer & analysis tool called the Blockchain 3D Explorer. I haven't used it for a while mostly (or really entirely) because my Samsung Gear VR Headset is more than a 1000s miles away from my current location! Although I think the virtual reality part is not really required. Looks like they might have a desktop app explorer which shows transactions in animated 3D, I think. I'll download it later and try it out. It's at https://blockchain3d.info

Here's an example of their BTC block explorer:

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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:15 am

hey nandibear,

Really good feed back. Great graphics! I've reviewed all of the (Coinbase-related) links you provided earlier.

In my second-to-last post, I opined a probable link between Coinbase's underlying code and that of Mt. Gox's.

Well, as I was researching that "code angle" (i.e., for the past week, every day, for hours, I've been watching the video-taped interviews of various exchange's CEOs, CFOs, CIOs, CPOs, etc. - and pundits thereof), I discovered that one of Mt. Gox's former coders had actually founded Kraken! Accordingly, I immediately focused in on Kraken's exchange and engaged in a comparison of the two (Kraken v Coinbase) - all the while pursuing my "where's the transaction IDs/hashes associated with my purchases of bitcoin?" question.

With the intention of both buying some XRP (more on that decision later... don't want to get political here) and obtaining associated transaction IDs/hashes, I opened up an account with Kraken, transferred some fiat, and, lo and behold, the Kraken exchange immediately provided me with both a "ledger" ID/hash and a "transaction" ID/hash (will share screen shots later).

However, earlier today, because I was unclear as to the "technical differences" (if any) between the transaction ID/hash generated via the deposit of funds into my Kraken account and a transaction ID/hash generated via my (planned) purchase of XRP (and/or bitcoin) via the Kraken exchage , I contacted Kraken's on-line (live) support team and posed that question (later on, I was informed that, (probably) due to the fact that the SEC has "sued" Ripple/XRP, at present, "US customers" are not allowed to purchase XRP via the Kraken exchange).

The person on the other end of the conversation was unable to answer the question so, via the submission of a request "ticket" (which will be "answered" via email), he/she referred me to what they call an "account funding agent" (or something similar). I'm waiting for their clarifying email.

Circling back to my originally-stated issue in this thread (i.e., I can't find/acquire transaction IDs/hashes associated with bitcoin purchases made via the Coinbase exchange), as I asserted in my original post, my primary motivation for attempting to obtain the transaction IDs/hashes associated with each bitcoin/UTXO I had purchased on Coinbase's exchange was my desire to be able to determine a coin/UTXO's "provenance" (i.e., from where did it originate?).

At that time, I had become (and still am) more than a little intrigued by this subject/issue. The issue had been broached, during several video-taped interviews, by Kevin O'Leary ("Mr. Wonderful" of TV's "Shark Tank" fame). He, and his partners/potential investors, were (allegedly) concerned as to whether, or not, a bitcoin/UTXO had been mined via a process which was harmful to the Earth's climate. It was (and still is) his position that, if a coin had been mined in a climate-unfriendly manner, said coin/UTXO should be "shunned"; an attitude which would effectively render some bitcoin less valuable than others! To determine where a coin "came from", all you had to do was "track its lineage" (provenance) back to its "genesis" block (e.g., via the use of block-explorer software) - as well as analyze all of its "stops" in between. This has been my quest for the past month. As you may have guessed, I've found that things aren't as simply as the first appeared to be.

Yesterday, while watching the host of "Whatbitcoindid"(.com) interview Bill Barhydt (a former software engineer for Goldman Sachs, a former director of Netscape, who, in 2014, founded Abra - a "remittance service" (i.e., a money transfer service often used by migrants to send part of their paychecks "home"/across borders)), the paradoxical nature of my quest to identify the "provenance" of my bitcoin was brought home to me when Mr. Barhydt rephrased the "provenance" question as bitcoin's "fungibility problem" (which, after hearing Mr. Barhydt talk, in my opinion, identifies a serious flaw in the blockchain protocol) .

What Mr. Barhydt was referring to was that, as a result of existing Anti-Money-Laundering (AML), and Know-Your-Customer (KYC), regulation's (i.e., "regulations" which compel all existing crypto-currency-related businesses to collect, store, and, upon government request, hand over virtually ALL RELEVANT DATA which clearly documents the "financial activities" engaged in by said business's customers), the present ability of a bank, crypto-currency-exchange operator, or government entity, to link a specific bitcoin/UTXO to a specific individual, and, then, to link those two pieces of information to a specific transaction, represents an inherent problem existent in the existing blockchain protocol in that, given the fact the above-mentioned entities routinely assert (and, enforce) the right to monitor the entirety of said crypto-currency-related business's compilation of the data which, collectively, will eventually become a blockchain entry (i.e, thereby, said "monitor" effectively dons the mantle of a "blockchain central authority"), such an unfettered anonymity-de-cloaking ability effectively relegates the concept of blockchain "decentralization" to the realm of "wishful thinking". Additionally, Mr. Barhydt warned that an "authority figure's" ability to "flag" a bitcoin/UTXO as being associated with some sort of "illegal"/unsanctioned activity would create an untenable environment/market in which some bitcoins/UTXOS were less valuable than others.

This is essentially the same argument Kevin O'Leary is making via his "climate-friendly bitcoin provenance" crusade.

Mr. Baryhydt asserts that the only way to avoid this unintended, and unforeseen, corruption of the concept of a decentralized blockchain is the gathering of concerned blockchain developers who share the goal of identifying, then implementing, a "fix" to the blockchain protocol - a "patch" which would eliminate anyone's, or any entity's, ability to link a specific blockchain entry to any specific individual.

I agree with him on this point. I think I'd like a world like that.

Also, during my ongoing search for Coinbase transaction IDs/hashes and their origins (i.e., their "genesis" block(s) and all their associated UTXOs), via my viewing of three separate, recently-video-taped, interviews in which Coinbase's CEO himself participated, I learned that, unbeknownst to most of its customers, the FBI, DEA, and IRS, have all paid Coinbase to provide their respective agencies with "customer data". This "agreement" seemed weird because, all throughout the interviews in question, Coinbase's CEO kept saying that any info Coinbase was giving up was publicly available anyway. The interview wasn't buying it and pushed back. The interviewers question was, "If the data was publicly available, why would the government pay for it?" Coinbase's CEO then made the lame statement that he didn't want to make regulators mad for no reason.

When this news first came to light, there was an uproar from a tech-savvy Twitter group... It's kind of weird that no one talks about this now.

Additionally, via Coinbase's own "press releases" (and, a few others), I learned that, in early 2019, Coinbase bought a blockchain-analytics firm named Neutrino which, in turn, employed several individuals who had worked for a business by the name of "Hacking Team". Before Neutrino's acquisition by Coinbase, the "Hacking Team" members had previously supplied spyware for oppressive foreign governments and have been alleged to be (at least partially) responsible for politically-motivated deaths, disappearances, harrassments, etc. Coinbase's CEO said he was unaware of this prior to Coinbase's acquisition of Neutrino. Neutrino's employees who were known to have been members of Hacking Team were fired a few months after the Coinbase acquisition but Coinbase keep the spyware software. This was only two years ago.


What's this got to do with my quest to obtain fiat-deposit, and bitcoin-purchase-related, transaction IDs/hashes from Coinbase?

Well, on May 15, 2021, in its 9th non-response to my transaction ID/hash inquires, Coinbase "Support Staff" emailed me the following:

"Coinbase operates as a hosted wallet service, meaning that all addresses we provide to you are for depositing funds only.

When you make a purchase using Coinbase or Coinbase Pro, these transactions are recorded internally on Coinbase and the crypto is allocated to your account via our internal ledger. There are no on-chain transactions for these purchases.

If you wish to send funds out of your Coinbase account to another wallet, those transactions will be recorded on the blockchain.

Please let us know if you have any further questions.

Regards,
Coinbase Support"
________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

At first blush, one might think nothing much of that email. However, given what I've learned about Coinbase's corporate "ethos" (the little I've been able to ascertain), among other things, I am more than a little "concerned" over the facts that (a) with respect to my many purchases of bitcoin via their exchange, I have not been given any info that would allow me to identify the specific bitcoin I have paid for, bitcoin which is now, allegedly, sitting in Coinbase's "internal ledger" (oh yeah, tomorrow, I'm finally getting around to transferring most of my coin to my Cold Card wallet), yet, via the "disclosure" agreements/contracts Coinbase has entered into with various agencies, more than a few government agencies know more about the underlying details of my purchases than I do, and, (b) unlike the tools provided by the Kraken exchange, tools which allow me to decide at which price I want to purchase bitcoin (i.e., I can see the bid/ask spread in real time, or I can set limit orders, or, I can buy at the current "market" price), when I place an order to buy, say $2000 worth of bitcoin via the Coinbase exchange, I have absolutely no idea where the bitcoin I'm given "came from" (remember, it's all about the "provenance"!) nor - until it's too late - do I have any idea as to at what price my "order" (clicking the "buy" button) was filled.

Meanwhile, I'm left wallowing within a paradoxical universe, of my own creation, in which I'm trying to utilize the (Kraken-exchange-provided) transaction IDs/hashes currently in my possession, with the goal of extracting as much info/data therefrom as possible, while, for all of the ("fungibility") reasons stated above, hoping that soon, no one else (including "me") will be able to do so.

I will be utilizing the 3D block explorer you just hipped me to. Thanks for your suggestions.

If you have any more advice, pointers, software/hardware suggestion, please let me know. I'll post the results of my 3D block explorer trial(s).

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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Wed Apr 28, 2021 5:54 am


...

At that time, I had become (and still am) more than a little intrigued by this subject/issue. The issue had been broached, during several video-taped interviews, by Kevin O'Leary ("Mr. Wonderful" of TV's "Shark Tank" fame). He, and his partners/potential investors, were (allegedly) concerned as to whether, or not, a bitcoin/UTXO had been mined via a process which was harmful to the Earth's climate. It was (and still is) his position that, if a coin had been mined in a climate-unfriendly manner, said coin/UTXO should be "shunned"; an attitude which would effectively render some bitcoin less valuable than others! To determine where a coin "came from", all you had to do was "track its lineage" (provenance) back to its "genesis" block (e.g., via the use of block-explorer software) - as well as analyze all of its "stops" in between. This has been my quest for the past month. As you may have guessed, I've found that things aren't as simply as the first appeared to be.

...


This is essentially the same argument Kevin O'Leary is making via his "climate-friendly bitcoin provenance" crusade.

...
Good evening dc077,

The most recent blocks (as of right now) and the pools which mined them can be seen in the screenshot below:

Image

Anyone (including you or I) in any country or any part of the world can direct the hashrate of thier mining machines to a bitcoin mining pool.

The mining pool itself doesn't even need it's own mining machines.

Even if you set aside the known mining pools (and their hashrate which can arrive from anywhere and anyone) there's no method to force a miner (any miner: a mining pool or a solo miner mining on his own not using a pool at all) to identify themselves.

Some pools (like the ones in screenshot above) choose to identify themselves. They do this by inserting the pool's name (or anything they want to insert) in the coinbase transaction (not related to the Coinbase.com Exchange):

Image

I don't think it's possible to determine whether or not bitcoins blocks were "mined via a process which was harmful to the Earth's climate" or "mined in a climate-unfriendly manner."

It should also be noted, FULL DISCLOSURE (laugh), that I'm not a cultist so I couldn't care less about climate cult stuff other than that I do find the climate cult itself to be dangerous as well as any legislation they might get passed and enacted into law.
Image

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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Fri Apr 30, 2021 3:40 am

Hey nandibear,

Thks again for your input. While perusing other bitcoin.com topics, I've noticed that you've posted some really insightful pieces!

I think the concept(s) of "the origin of a block" (and it's "traceability") and "Coinbase's (the exchange) handing over transaction info/data to the Feds (i.e., DEA, FBI, IRS, etc.)" has, unfortunately, been conflated in this thread (I have no problem bearing the blame here).

For clarity's sake on this issue, I am basically begging you to listen to the conversation between 3 very respected bitcoin proponents which was engaged in on April 14, 2021, in a Whatbitcoindid podcast (specifically, listen to minutes 26 - 27 at the very least; the whole podcast is apprx 1:25:00 long). The last time I included a URL in this forum my post was rejected so you'll have to go to the address yourself (.com).

I get what you're saying. I'm not a cultist either; I'd like to think I'm a realist. Bill Barhydt is a real veteran when it comes to all-things-digital; he is not a conspiracy theorist, and, he makes an excellent point. The other gentleman featured in that interview - Simon Dixon - is a "bitcoin veteran"/proponent from the earliest days and opines from a perspective of a "financier"/banker/bitcoiner (he, and his wife, actually started a "bitcoin-centric" bank!) The interview was hosted by Peter McCormack - another bit "bitcoin veteran". He has conducted/recorded some really eye-opening bitcoin-related interviews.

With all that said, I'm still conducting my own research...

I've run into a sticky issue... In an effort to "hedge my positions", I've been trying to buy some XRP - without success. So far, upon "realizing" that I'm accessing their respective exchanges from America, every exchange I've tried has denied my attempts to purchase XRP via their exchanges. Do you know of any "place"/exchange which will allow me to purchase XRP? Only Americans are being prevented from purchasing this alt-coin!

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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Fri Apr 30, 2021 4:19 am

Hey nandi,

The "Whatbitcoindid" interview I referred to in my last post was entitled "Bitcoin v. The Banks" and was Episode #334. That might have helped! Oops...

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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Mon May 10, 2021 4:23 pm

Hey nandi,

The "Whatbitcoindid" interview I referred to in my last post was entitled "Bitcoin v. The Banks" and was Episode #334. That might have helped! Oops...
hey dc007,

Interesting. I'll search for the referenced interview and give it a listen!
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Re: Coinbase transaction numbers

Mon May 10, 2021 4:47 pm

I think the concept(s) of "the origin of a block" (and it's "traceability") and "Coinbase's (the exchange) handing over transaction info/data to the Feds (i.e., DEA, FBI, IRS, etc.)" has, unfortunately, been conflated in this thread (I have no problem bearing the blame here).
Not that I'm aware of. If anything has been conflated please point this out and I'll double check. While 'coinbase transaction' has been used in both senses (buying bitcoins from the Coinbase Exchange and the block reward transaction for finding (mining) a bitcoin block) throughout this thread i do not see where they've been conflated.
For clarity's sake on this issue, I am basically begging you to listen to the conversation between 3 very respected bitcoin proponents which was engaged in on April 14, 2021, in a Whatbitcoindid podcast (specifically, listen to minutes 26 - 27 at the very least; the whole podcast is apprx 1:25:00 long). The last time I included a URL in this forum my post was rejected so you'll have to go to the address yourself (.com).
Absolutely, I'll give it a listen.
The last time I included a URL in this forum my post was rejected so you'll have to go to the address yourself (.com).
Sorry about that. To help combat spam posts from spammers the Administrator of this forum blocked news users from posting links a few years ago. It was later applied to all users. Then later on even URLs (no hyperlink) were blocked (unless you have a posting history of 10 post.

Looks like you're at 10 posts now so you should be able to post a URL (not a link, no tags, just the URL itself).

I've run into a sticky issue... In an effort to "hedge my positions", I've been trying to buy some XRP - without success. So far, upon "realizing" that I'm accessing their respective exchanges from America, every exchange I've tried has denied my attempts to purchase XRP via their exchanges. Do you know of any "place"/exchange which will allow me to purchase XRP? Only Americans are being prevented from purchasing this alt-coin!
Unfortunately I cannot help with anything related to XRP and Ripple. From the outset I've distanced myself from them and have always thought of them as a banker's coin (transfers between banks and conducted by the bankers themselves). Transactions can be held up. Permission based.

I've never owned any XPR and have no experience with how or where to buy and sell it.
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